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Old September 24th, 2013, 10:37 PM #21
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This series is a horrible idea that I really think will flop. It's called Gotham and features James Gordon and Batman's rogue gallery but not Batman? What they're doing is "Batman" without Batman, the audience will be constantly reminded that Batman isn't there and that's not a good thing.
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Old September 24th, 2013, 10:44 PM #22
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Pepper wrote: View Post

This series is a horrible idea that I really think will flop. It's called Gotham and features James Gordon and Batman's rogue gallery but not Batman? What they're doing is "Batman" without Batman, the audience will be constantly reminded that Batman isn't there and that's not a good thing.
This is exactly why I think this show is going to fail. Its focusing to much on the Bat Family villains without having the Bat Family themselves.

I have faith in this being good but at the same time eh. I want this on CW and be focused around the Gotham Central comic idea. To me that had the potential to spawn a Spectre TV show. If you put on the CW your talking about Arrow, Flash if it gets picked up, Gotham and then later possible Spectre? I mean anything to get Spectre on tv or movie personally. Still I have my doubts of it succeeding but I'll keep an open mind I hope its good.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 12:32 AM #23
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this is going to fail. too many superhero or related shows coming now. yes i know gordon wasn't isn't a superhero but he is related to the bat family. between Arrow, the flash pilot and now agents of shield i believe the superhero tv series will be done in a few years. gotham will just be another cop show with a hint of supervillians.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 12:39 AM #24
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Er. Why does "related to heroes" mean it's going to fail? Like, it seems like there's a formula in your mind that you left out.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 12:49 AM #25
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ZeoFan88 wrote: View Post

between Arrow, the flash pilot and now agents of shield i believe the superhero tv series will be done in a few years.
That's just four shows, it's really not that much, how many cop shows are airing at the moment, something like 30?
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Old September 25th, 2013, 01:10 AM #26
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Wow, didn't see this coming. But it's quite an odd move to use Batman villains without using Batman. Not that it can't work, as I would love to see how a regular detective solves the problems they'd present, but it's still odd.

I wonder if they could eventually introduce Barbara to the story, like as a whiz kid hacker to lend support where Gordon scolds her, or a rookie cop eager to prove herself to her father.

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Er. Why does "related to heroes" mean it's going to fail? Like, it seems like there's a formula in your mind that you left out.
Pepper wrote: View Post

That's just four shows, it's really not that much, how many cop shows are airing at the moment, something like 30?
Well, we all know cops and doctors and lawyers are always going to be first selection for new dramas. But superheroes seem to get lumped into the "this is for kids" category, which doesn't give them a very long shelf life. That, or the writing jumps that shark so fast that even the most ardent fans can't take it seriously.

NeoZeoRedRanger wrote: View Post

I hate most CGI animated series in general, but GL and Beware the Batman were/are horrible.
What's so bad about Beware? Granted, I'm aware CGI isn't a lot of people's cup of tea (it's not even mine, really), but aside from Katana, the writing's been pretty good.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 02:36 AM #27
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One thing confuses me. Why is Gotham going to be on Fox when DC Comics owner Warner has a half share in The CW? All DC shows would logically go there!
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Old September 25th, 2013, 02:47 AM #28
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Digifiend wrote: View Post

One thing confuses me. Why is Gotham going to be on Fox when DC Comics owner Warner has a half share in The CW? All DC shows would logically go there!
Fox is probably flipping the bill for the Gotham show.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 02:56 AM #29
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PrimoPiccolo wrote: View Post

Well, we all know cops and doctors and lawyers are always going to be first selection for new dramas. But superheroes seem to get lumped into the "this is for kids" category, which doesn't give them a very long shelf life.
Oh, I don't doubt the super hero fad will fizzle out sooner or later but four shows on three networks are not over-saturating the market.

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One thing confuses me. Why is Gotham going to be on Fox when DC Comics owner Warner has a half share in The CW? All DC shows would logically go there!
No, logically DC would try to spread them out over several networks because that allows them to have more shows on the air at the same time, especially if they're also internally competing with other non-DC WB shows.

And what makes you think The CW would even be interested in more than two DC shows? They don't have that many hours available, isn't it just 10 per week? With Arrow and Flash they'll have 20% of their schedule filled with DC super heroes next season and they're still developing Wonder Woman.

Another thing is Oliver Queen is already a less crazy Bruce Wayne, they don't need Batman without Batman, picking a powered hero as their second DC show is a better choice.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 03:01 AM #30
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I think it has legs, I hope they encircle Gordon with characters like Bullock and Flass, and you could probably stand to make Zzaz the first recurring villain of the peice, as he's a grounded type you can expect in real life and not just in comic books
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Old September 25th, 2013, 03:04 AM #31
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Tobias Whale is already on my want list.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 04:52 AM #32
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So if it's on a different network, I'm guessing it won't be crossing over with Arrow/Flash anytime soon? Seems like a missed opportunity, with DC so desperate to get a foothold on shared universes.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 07:04 AM #33
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^Well, we pretty much know that Arrow isn't in the same universe as the DCCU, if only because of the Flash news, so there's really no point in combining it with this show, assuming this show does tie into the DCCU
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Old September 25th, 2013, 07:33 AM #34
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^ well this show will be about Gordon but well maybe they do some Batman references or maybe this could by before even the Bruce Wayne incident.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 07:44 AM #35
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Here's my only real worry about this: CBS just did Golden Boy, about a detective who was destined to go on to become the Police Commissioner. A Detective Gordon series would/could basically be that premise. We'd likely continue to get references to how he's destined to do great things, and how he'll probably make very powerful allies or something one day. I don't think I'd necessarily want to sit through another destiny-oriented show, that just sort of dicks around for 10 years or so while leading up to/holding off on Gordon finally reaching the role that he's fated for. It would be interesting to have a series that shows Gordon forging those key partnerships within the GCPD over the years leading up to his eventual role, but I don't know that I'd want yet another series about it.

Also, it would be pre-Batman, meaning most familiar names, even from within the GCPD, wouldn't even be around for quite some time. I'd rather a series that's a bit more established with what we know, even if it's only in the early days, and just goes from there. A Blue Bloods-type show set against the backdrop of a Gotham with the legend of the Batman looming in the background would be great. You don't have to show Batman or have him be a part of the show at all. But it does add something, and Gotham Central was a great comic book series. I would LOVE to see that in TV form.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 08:10 AM #36
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This sounds like it could be cool, but no matter how good it is the average person won't tune in if Batman doesn't show in some way.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 08:31 AM #37
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It's supposed to be Gotham Central. Which was about the normal police working Gotham and having to deal with the crazies Batman fights or leaves for them or just aren't at his level yet.

I don't want to see it if it's just young Jim Gordon.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 09:10 AM #38
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There's always that great debate, do Batman's villains exist because he exists, or does the Batman exist because his villains do? "The Trial" from TAS kind of answered that pretty well, the gimmicks might have been a little different, but the villains would still exist in some form or another. But to the police, Batman's existence produces a wealth of crazy and bizarre criminals plaguing Gotham's streets.

That's what I'd want to see, the police force that has to deal with those crazies that have sprung up in the city. No superheroes in capes swinging in to save the day each week. Just the men and women of GCPD working to catch each criminal in one of the worst cities in the DC Universe.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 09:21 AM #39
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Note that everyone keeps calling it "Gotham Central", but that wasn't part of the pitch idea nor the current talk from those in charge of it. While an amazing comic and I hope they take aspects from it, it wasn't any more a factor or influence in this idea than the comic Man of Steel origin was to Man Of Steal the movie.

A police show set in the highest crime rate city in the United States featuring a few good cops who believe that things could be better amidst a corrupt organisation, with maffia and gangs and weird "freaks" (think Whale, think Ventriloquist, think Catwoman, Humpty Dumpty, a non-costumed activist seeking "anarky", etc) on the outside.
This will be before Batman, a Detective Jim Gordon, and an awful place to live with strong people who can't leave or refuse to leave. Personally judging from the Nolan movies, which were written more as crime/social unrest terrorism movies that happened to have Batman in it to justify things and people loving the non-Batman aspects so much (a certain young cop for example), and I think better had it not been Batman at all. I'm for this idea because it can be a set for great stories and atmosphere of actual urban crime and monsters that CSI with their magic do-it-all cops don't touch to be "family" drama.

Note as well that this idea, has actually been bouncing around since the 1990s. At one point the failed "Grayson" idea would incorporated aspects of it with an Officer Grayson.
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Old September 25th, 2013, 09:29 AM #40
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I loved Birds of Prey. It proved that a lower-stakes Batman live-action series without Batman could work, and all the live-action superhero shows that have come out since have shown that supers can be done on a budget.

It could be like The Wire with psychos, as opposed to how SHIELD seems to be going for a more spectacular, optimistic organization series.
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