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Old February 28th, 2019, 02:37 PM #341
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TheLastBlade wrote: View Post

Goddamn, I donít even know whatís happening anymore.
That's a YouTube rando monetizing their reading twitter. Their clickbait title about people begging Vic to drop his lawsuit is based on... a random tweet in a hashtag with one like that doesn't even mention the lawsuit.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 02:38 PM #342
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Harpsikord wrote: View Post

I've said it once and I'll say it again - this lawsuit will do nothing but harm Mignogna himself. And for that matter, so much for his so-called apology he issued before. Is this what admitting fault and finding religion looks like, Vic? I don't think so.
Are you saying that Vic shouldn't have filed a lawsuit, and just accept what everyone is saying about him, and just be convicted? Is this what I'm hearing from this? I mean, seriously, this is what I've been talking about. It sounds like to me that he shouldn't be able to defend himself, he should just take it, apologize (even though he did apologize, and the people still attacked regardless), and then be sentenced, without having any sort of trial or a way to defend himself.

I'd like to also point out that all of this hearsay about him 'doing things for years", has been brought up by Vic himself at cons a few years ago. He knows that people have posted that stuff online about him. He's not blind. If you don't believe me, just search on Youtube for "Vic at Anime-zing 2016". There's a meet and greet panel with Vic, where it's brought up. The video is over a hour long, but it's around the 25 minute mark.

Of course, that doesn't matter to people that want to see Vic fry and not get a fair trial, because anything that shows that things are wrong, are either ignored, or taken out of context.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 02:49 PM #343
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Are you saying that Vic shouldn't have filed a lawsuit, and just accept what everyone is saying about him, and just be convicted? Is this what I'm hearing from this? I mean, seriously, this is what I've been talking about. It sounds like to me that he shouldn't be able to defend himself, he should just take it, apologize (even though he did apologize, and the people still attacked regardless), and then be sentenced, without having any sort of trial or a way to defend himself.
Who the hell is talking about conviction here? Seriously, my dude. How many times does it have to be said that there is no real legal action that can be taken here? Mignogna harassed a bunch of people, fans and co-workers, and he was called out about it. He did this over ten years. It led to Rooster Teeth and Funimation doing their own internal investigations about this man - where they found him guilty.

That was the point that it went from being simple accusations to the fact that Mignogna did this, he claimed to apologize, but now he's trying to go after the people that spoke out against him with a defamation lawsuit - but there was no defamation to be spoken of in the first place.

All a lawsuit is going to do on his end is show him in an even worse light than he's even being seen in presently and make him broke even quicker than he was going to be before. He's not going to win this lawsuit, if it even goes forward, and then how is he going to pay for all of those legal fees?

I'd like to also point out that all of this hearsay about him 'doing things for years", has been brought up by Vic himself at cons a few years ago. He knows that people have posted that stuff online about him. He's not blind. If you don't believe me, just search on Youtube for "Vic at Anime-zing 2016". There's a meet and greet panel with Vic, where it's brought up. The video is over a hour long, but it's around the 25 minute mark.
Important question: if he was aware of his behavior then why didn't he stop? Because he's not a great person.

Of course, that doesn't matter to people that want to see Vic fry and not get a fair trial, because anything that shows that things are wrong, are either ignored, or taken out of context.
How many more times does it need to be emphasized that no one is being charged with a crime, and that no one will be charged with a crime as it stands, before you accept that?

This is all about public perception and what he did (note: I am not saying 'did or did not' for a reason) do.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 02:57 PM #344
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Are you saying that Vic shouldn't have filed a lawsuit, and just accept what everyone is saying about him, and just be convicted?
Your rationale is all over the place. You acknowledged pages ago that Vic was owning up to his own mistakes and that he should be commended for it. Now you're saying he's in the right to sue them and shouldn't accept it. Which one is it? Does he accept he made mistakes with grace or does he contradict that by taking them to court? Seems like you're ready to defend him no matter which action he takes.

GalaxyRed wrote:
Is this what I'm hearing from this?
No, it's what you're pretending you're hearing so you can keep denying his wrongdoing.

I'm asking this as well because you haven't answered Titanium's question and I want you to: what do you think the point of faking the accusations is? What is their end goal? What do people have to gain from this? I'm going to keep asking this until you give an answer.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:07 PM #345
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Harpsikord wrote: View Post

Important question: if he was aware of his behavior then why didn't he stop? Because he's not a great person.
If you watched the video I was talking about, you'd see that it wasn't him "being aware of his actions", he's aware of people making false claims of what he's been doing at cons (like him getting handsy than normal with fans, instead of just giving hugs and maybe kisses on the cheek with the consent of the fans), and how anyone could say anything online, and have their words be believed and ruin someone's reputation and career, as well as their life. He even points out how horrible that is.

As for the "conviction" stuff, FUNImation actually did two investigations for Vic, where one was inconclusive, right before the Broly movie premiered in theaters. Then they did a second one that suddenly "found reason for his dismissal" right after the movie was out, which I find a little suspect in itself.

Also, trying to say "nothing is being defamed here" is false. It's defamation of character. Vic has a right to sue for that, and with the way everyone that has been accusing him has been acting online (even his former co-workers), he does have solid evidence that shows this. Trying to say "he's not going to win this lawsuit", because reasons. Well, we'll see won't we?
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:21 PM #346
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Nothing is being defamed because the fact is that he did it. The moment that a judge sees the sheer amount of testimony from victims and witnesses, the lawsuit will be thrown out - because he did the things that he's being accused of. It's very important to note that he lost his two highest profile jobs, one of which is with the biggest dubbing company in the west, because they themselves did an investigation into what was being said. And guess what? They found that he was guilty. He did the things that people are saying he did. That is not a question at this point in time. And, as a result, his character is not being defamed. Even if some people are bandwagoning here, we know that he is guilty of at least enough of these things for Funimation and Rooster Teeth to fire him. As soon as a judge hears that, the lawsuit will be thrown out.

Also - inconclusive means that they didn't find anything one way or the other, or claimed not to, it doesn't absolve him of any guilt. The fact is that he was close with one of the higher ups at the time and said higher up is gone now, so when they did the second investigation they found proof of the things that Vic did. That's literally simple.

I'm also not going to watch a youtube video posted by an alt-right channel that defends child porn. Try again. Or, maybe, wise up and don't.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:21 PM #347
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

As for the "conviction" stuff, FUNImation actually did two investigations for Vic, where one was inconclusive, right before the Broly movie premiered in theaters. Then they did a second one that suddenly "found reason for his dismissal" right after the movie was out, which I find a little suspect in itself.
That's not a conviction. That's a private company leading an internal investigation against an employee and determining that keeping him is a moral and financial liability. No courts were involved whatsoever. Quit trying to conflate the two.

GalaxyRed wrote:
Then they did a second one that suddenly "found reason for his dismissal" right after the movie was out, which I find a little suspect in itself.
Because Funimation didn't feel the need to fire him when the hubbub against him wasn't as big. Pretty easy explanation. Funi made the right call firing him but it's agreed by plenty that they were complicit in him doing this for years and only took action because it was no longer viable to keep him.

But your vague usage of "suspect" leads me to ask a second time: what do the accusers have to gain from lying? How would they benefit from a conspiracy to defame him? Answer the question.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:29 PM #348
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Yes he has a case but it isn't criminal. It is also up to him to prove what they're saying is false. That is the hard part he has to deal with. As he is the one suing the burden of proof of defamation is on him. There is evidence proving he has been investigated for his behavior and fired for it. So this will be held against him in the court as well. Sometimes it is better to let things die down than it is to fight it. He is in a lose lose situation.

So again he does have a case for defamation but if he wins it or not is still up in the air. It won't stop these things anyway. His career is over.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:41 PM #349
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Cuchulainn wrote: View Post

But your vague usage of "suspect" leads me to ask a second time: what do the accusers have to gain from lying? How would they benefit from a conspiracy to defame him? Answer the question.
Why is it every single time I bring something up, everyone just assumes that I'm saying victims are lying? I never said that Vic is innocent. I said he's innocent until proven guilty. You know, how the actual law is? Why is that always ignored when I talk about this?

Also, there are some accusers that could benefit from defaming him, if they're not telling the whole truth (and I'm not saying that they're lying, please read that I said IF). Monica Rial and Jamie Marchi have both come forward, saying they had similar experiences with him (down to the hair pulling in public and having words whispered in their ears, in front of fans). They both work for FUNimation. It sounds like they corroborated with each other for their stories. I'm not saying they did, I'm saying it sounds very suspicious. I should also point out that when people have questioned this online, in a nice manner (they weren't attacking them at all), they have retaliated and threatened them.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:49 PM #350
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Why is it every single time I bring something up, everyone just assumes that I'm saying victims are lying? I never said that Vic is innocent. I said he's innocent until proven guilty. You know, how the actual law is? Why is that always ignored when I talk about this?
I'll keep reposting until the cows come home.

TeraMan wrote: View Post

Ok, let me be even more direct in what other people have already said:

The reason victims aren't going to the law first is because the law can't help them.

The justice system as is wasn't built to accommodate the unique circumstances that comes from sexual assault crimes that most other crimes don't account for, and not even necessarily because the court gives the accused a pass:
  • Testimonies can't be given by victims due to how traumatic incidents can affect memory, fear of societal shaming for testifying, AND be retraumatizing for the victim to recall the events...while doing it in front of several strangers (police officers, judges, jury, etc)
  • The statue of limitations being a thing where, even if the victim IS ready to testify, too much time has past and the court legally cannot reopen the case.
  • Gathering of evidence could be considered invasive if it involves gather body samples and thus not wanting to go through with giving their permission on their end.
Calling out on social media is the only space that people feel comfortable with doing this sort of thing due to the Internet providing a...better...barrier of anonymity to at least slow down any potential harassment. And instead relying on the companies that hire the accused to make the final decision themselves instead of the law institutions. Which even then, it doesn't guarantee results that people want.

The "trust victims" mantra and people favoring "the court of public opinion" over the "court of law" isn't JUST a sign of solidarity. It's the only thing they have.

It's not that the law won't help them. It's because they CAN'T help them.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 03:52 PM #351
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Oh we victim shaming now? That what we're doing? Aight then.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:00 PM #352
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TeraMan wrote: View Post

I'll keep reposting until the cows come home.
Did I say anything in that post that the victims should've gone to the police, or reported anything? I wasn't even talking about that. Everyone keeps saying that I'm saying the victims are lying. I didn't say that at all. But clearly I must be if I think that Vic deserves to be treated as "innocent until proven guilty".

Just because they "feel comfortable" on social media, by the way, doesn't make it right. Anyone that doesn't speak up sooner, and just stays quiet just hurts potential victims. It doesn't matter if the accused is "famous and they're afraid their voices won't be heard", them staying quiet is not the right thing to do in this situation whatsoever. You keep trying to say that every victim does this. I've seen women online that have said otherwise, and are against what's happening. And no, they're not "underaged fans of Vic that like him for anything he does". These are victims themselves, who are unrelated to Vic's case, that have come out to talk about this situation. There's one that's a Youtube content creator, named MechaRandom42, who has said as much in a couple of her videos.

Oh wait, I can't name a Youtube creator, right? Because she's obviously doing it for clicks, and if they cover videos that you disagree with, her words don't matter.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:02 PM #353
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Also, there are some accusers that could benefit from defaming him, if they're not telling the whole truth (and I'm not saying that they're lying, please read that I said IF). Monica Rial and Jamie Marchi have both come forward, saying they had similar experiences with him (down to the hair pulling in public and having words whispered in their ears, in front of fans). They both work for FUNimation. It sounds like they corroborated with each other for their stories. I'm not saying they did, I'm saying it sounds very suspicious. I should also point out that when people have questioned this online, in a nice manner (they weren't attacking them at all), they have retaliated and threatened them.
I know this is going to shock you... but people who commit sexual assault? They tend to have a pattern of behavior. That's the psychology of sexual assault. 60+ women can tell you Cosby's MO of rape.

The fact that two women who work in his industry who allege that he assaulted them happened to do work at Funimation is like saying that it's suspicious that an employee of a company assaulted other employees. That's how it fucking happens. You're sitting there as if Funimation isn't the biggest anime production company in the US. It'd be odd to find a professional voice actor who has not worked with them in some capacity.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:03 PM #354
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Why is it every single time I bring something up, everyone just assumes that I'm saying victims are lying?
Because you've been bringing into doubt the veracity of the accusations from the very beginning while refusing to accept the testimonial evidence that exists even when it's laid out in front of you. You're painting the picture of a duck and when people ask "Are you painting a duck?" you insist they're just a bunch of ink splotches that have nothing to do with each other. Like, you're not an idiot, and neither is anyone in this thread. We know what you're doing.

GalaxyRed wrote:
I never said that Vic is innocent. I said he's innocent until proven guilty. You know, how the actual law is? Why is that always ignored when I talk about this?
Because you keep bringing it up as a red herring. They've explained to you that this isn't criminal court and you've outright ignored those points to keep trying to distract from the argument. And nobody's biting.

GalaxyRed wrote:
They both work for FUNimation. It sounds like they corroborated with each other for their stories. I'm not saying they did, I'm saying it sounds very suspicious.
Once again you haven't answered the question. You're saying "They work for Funimation" which tells me nothing. All that says is they have a common employer. Tell me, in specific examples, of what people could gain from fabricating or lying about the accusations.

GalaxyRed wrote:
Because she's obviously doing it for clicks, and if they cover videos that you disagree with, her words don't matter.
If they make videos defending anime CP like loli or shota? Yes. 100%. Not sure how you think this is a "gotcha" in any form. I refuse to listen to anyone who thinks those things are defensible.

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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:12 PM #355
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Just because they "feel comfortable" on social media, by the way, doesn't make it right. Anyone that doesn't speak up sooner, and just stays quiet just hurts potential victims.
You obviously didn't actually read my post.

TeraMan wrote: View Post

  • Testimonies can't be given by victims due to how traumatic incidents can affect memory, fear of societal shaming for testifying, AND be retraumatizing for the victim to recall the events...while doing it in front of several strangers (police officers, judges, jury, etc)
  • The statue of limitations being a thing where, even if the victim IS ready to testify, too much time has past and the court legally cannot reopen the case.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:28 PM #356
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Did I say anything in that post that the victims should've gone to the police, or reported anything? I wasn't even talking about that. Everyone keeps saying that I'm saying the victims are lying. I didn't say that at all. But clearly I must be if I think that Vic deserves to be treated as "innocent until proven guilty".

Just because they "feel comfortable" on social media, by the way, doesn't make it right. Anyone that doesn't speak up sooner, and just stays quiet just hurts potential victims. It doesn't matter if the accused is "famous and they're afraid their voices won't be heard", them staying quiet is not the right thing to do in this situation whatsoever.
Take it up with a culture that encourages not speaking up.

You keep trying to say that every victim does this. I've seen women online that have said otherwise, and are against what's happening.
I don't think anyone has said every victim does this.

And no, they're not "underaged fans of Vic that like him for anything he does". These are victims themselves, who are unrelated to Vic's case, that have come out to talk about this situation. There's one that's a Youtube content creator, named MechaRandom42, who has said as much in a couple of her videos.
So because they got over their trauma (or actually in the rare case had the system actually supported them) everyone else should just do as they do?

Oh wait, I can't name a Youtube creator, right? Because she's obviously doing it for clicks, and if they cover videos that you disagree with, her words don't matter.
No, it's the bullshit that some people seem to think that because some victims easily get over what happens to them then others should just buck up and deal with it without actually ever considering that they're not that person...
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:29 PM #357
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Cuchulainn wrote: View Post

Because you've been bringing into doubt the veracity of the accusations from the very beginning while refusing to accept the testimonial evidence that exists even when it's laid out in front of you. You're painting the picture of a duck and when people ask "Are you painting a duck?" you insist they're just a bunch of ink splotches that have nothing to do with each other. Like, you're not an idiot, and neither is anyone in this thread. We know what you're doing.
I have only brought up the "doubts" of the accusations that have been said publicly online recently. I haven't said every single one of them was false, and I never said that the ones I doubt was lying. I said that there's some suspicions for them. But since I see suspicion, I must be saying that they're lying. You know that's not how the word doubt is used, right?

Because you keep bringing it up as a red herring. They've explained to you that this isn't criminal court and you've outright ignored those points to keep trying to distract from the argument. And nobody's biting.
You do know that's not how it works, right? You don't get to accuse someone and then deem them guilty right on the spot. Even people that are allegedly sexual assaulting other people. But apparently that's not how the world works now. Social media can deem people guilty without any evidence, just because they can, and with no consequences. (NOTE: "Without evidence" means exactly what it is, these things that are said online aren't testimonies, because they're not said with any lawyers present, or even a police report filed, but since this "isn't a criminal court", as you said, so to you guys, they matter.)

Once again you haven't answered the question. You're saying "They work for Funimation" which tells me nothing. All that says is they have a common employer. Tell me, in specific examples, of what people could gain from fabricating or lying about the accusations.
Seriously? You're just ignoring the fact that they're co-workers that have the same story that they've told? And ignoring the fact that when someone questions their stories that they've threatened to sue them with harassment?

Xenotome wrote: View Post

No, it's the bullshit that some people seem to think that because some victims easily get over what happens to them then others should just buck up and deal with it without actually ever considering that they're not that person...
You know what, maybe you should just look at the videos of that Youtuber before you start making accusations like this. Here, I'll help you, and just link the two videos where she talks about this:




Last edited by GalaxyRed; February 28th, 2019 at 04:41 PM.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:42 PM #358
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

You do know that's not how it works, right? You don't get to accuse someone and then deem them guilty right on the spot. Even people that are allegedly sexual assaulting other people. But apparently that's not how the world works now. Social media can deem people guilty without any evidence, just because they can, and with no consequences. (NOTE: "Without evidence" means exactly what it is, these things that are said online aren't testimonies, because they're not said with any lawyers present, or even a police report filed, but since this "isn't a criminal court", as you said, so to you guys, they matter.)
There's not a shred of physical evidence that Bill Cosby raped even one of those 60+ victims. Do you think he did?



Seriously? You're just ignoring the fact that they're co-workers that have the same story that they've told?
You mean a co-worker can't assault more than one person in a work place? Again... nearly every anime voice actor has worked with Funimation at some point... especially if you're based in Texas where Funimation is located. That you see this is as suspicious really shows that you don't give two shits about what really happened. You have not lobbed one criticism at Vic, to sit there and say you're not calling anybody liars is a bold face lie. You have done nothing but spout "doubts" about the stories of these women and straw man people who have nothing to do with them as "suspicious" just because you don't say the words "They're lying" or "It's a big conspiracy and funimation is in on it!" doesn't mean that's not what you're saying.

And ignoring the fact that when someone questions their stories that they've threatened to sue them with harassment?
When you have random people harassing you online do you lash out? I mean said aside the fact that they apologized for how they reacted...
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:44 PM #359
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GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

You know what, maybe you should just look at the videos of that Youtuber before you start making accusations like this. Here, I'll help you, and just link the two videos where she talks about this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efKapRxGqxg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_0II4yk36s
Really don't give a shit about what one person has to say. She doesn't speak for other victims. Their stories are not her's.

And frankly... that woman quite off her rocker. She's literally got (in the last 2 weeks) 18 10-20 minute videos bitching about Captain Marvel. That is on average more than 1 every god damn day.

Last edited by Xenotome; February 28th, 2019 at 04:54 PM.
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Old February 28th, 2019, 04:45 PM #360
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GalaxyRed wrote:
I have only brought up the "doubts" of the accusations that have been said publicly online recently. I haven't said every single one of them was false, and I never said that the ones I doubt was lying. I said that there's some suspicions for them.
And if you thought they were nothing more than suspicious outliers you would've said your piece and left. But that's not what you're doing. You've been in this thread non-stop defending Vic and dismissing testimony. You don't have to say you think they're lying because it's easy to tell from basic inference that's what you want to believe.

GalaxyRed wrote:
You don't get to accuse someone and then deem them guilty right on the spot. Even people that are allegedly sexual assaulting other people.
Fuck are you talking about? That happens all the time. We don't live in some sort of abstract Justice Machine that forces us to approach every single incident forensically. People can and do make judgments on people every day. The only time "innocent before guilty" becomes relevant is in criminal court. People have seen the evidence of testimony leveraged against Vic and collectively have decided he likely committed the act.

GalaxyRed wrote: View Post

Seriously? You're just ignoring the fact that they're co-workers that have the same story that they've told? And ignoring the fact that when someone questions their stories that they've threatened to sue them with harassment?
Still not answering the question. Give examples.

Last edited by Cuchulainn; February 28th, 2019 at 04:55 PM.
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