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Old June 19th, 2017, 10:46 AM   #641
johnboy3434
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Originally Posted by Merlin View Post
The Amazons were created to fight for peace, but until Steve they were completely ignorant that the outside world had already changed for the worse and had needed them for three years. How could they fulfill their purpose if they only learn about it in hindsight? Was Ares that good at hiding the war from their senses?
I interpreted it as the Amazons having become complacent and maybe a bit arrogant, with Diana being the one to re-awaken their purpose and do what they should have been doing the whole time.
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Old June 19th, 2017, 10:53 AM   #642
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I interpreted it as the Amazons having become complacent and maybe a bit arrogant, with Diana being the one to re-awaken their purpose and do what they should have been doing the whole time.
That's true. It didn't help that the Queen was the most skeptical, choosing to live by the possibility that Ares might never return, because she was obsessed with establishing a normal life for her special daughter. I wonder if by the time Steve arrived, Hippolyta had already sensed Ares might be awake and been jealously hoarding it just to have a little more time with Diana. But once Steve confirmed it openly, there was nothing she could do.
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Old June 19th, 2017, 11:04 AM   #643
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It's probably explained in the comics, but I now find it strange that none of the movie Amazons "sensed" Ares as soon as the war started, rather than having to hear about it from Steve after millions had already died. If war stirs up hatred in men's hearts, wouldn't the Amazons have sensed the German boats coming long before they breached the barrier? The war had been going on for about three years before Steve arrived; surely atrocities would have occurred within range of Themyscira for someone to have "felt" Ares' influence.

The Amazons were created to fight for peace, but until Steve they were completely ignorant that the outside world had already changed for the worse and had needed them for three years. How could they fulfill their purpose if they only learn about it in hindsight? Was Ares that good at hiding the war from their senses?
It's not like they can just pinpoint where Ares is. Their purpose yes, is to fight Ares but stuck on Themyscira didn't give them access to the world, thus not able to fulfill their purpose. So it's not strange. They had lived for however many years on the island, kept apart from the world not knowing anything that was going on in it so of course they wouldn't know Ares was active again. And being at peace for so long they grew to doubt Ares would ever reemerge so made no effort to go out beyond the barrier not to mention they made it clear if you leave you may never be able to come back.

And that's the point of Diana, being the only child she was raised on stories of their battles, their purpose in fighting Ares, etc etc. She had all that youthful fire and purpose and hope. And a healthy dose of naiveté in having been kept on the island. But she was right in terms of going forward into the world again to fight Ares and try and save people it's just all the other Amazons had grown up with fighting, so even though they practiced and trained it's not the same as real battle and they weren't as excited at the idea of losing that peace they had earned.
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Old June 19th, 2017, 11:29 AM   #644
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Maybe that's what confused me. It reminded me of Japanese holdout soldiers like Hiiro Oonoda who spent years stationed after 1945, oblivious that the war was over because the Allies had cut off all communication during it. When someone finally arrived, it took them a while to believe it.

The Amazons' purpose was squandered because they were marooned for centuries in a Bermuda triangle. That could explain lack of physical interaction or communication, but I guess I didn't expect that would extend to being cut off from sensing conflict of any kind, especially one as massive as the war. Especially since they had been created as a result of war, to fight for peace.

You'd think their purpose would allow that one exception so they could relax for years until something really big would snap them out and get them ready to fight. But then we wouldn't have the series.
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Old June 19th, 2017, 11:44 AM   #645
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Maybe that's what confused me. It reminded me of Japanese holdout soldiers like Hiiro Oonoda who spent years stationed after 1945, oblivious that the war was over because the Allies had cut off all communication during it. When someone finally arrived, it took them a while to believe it.

The Amazons' purpose was squandered because they were marooned for centuries in a Bermuda triangle. That could explain lack of physical interaction or communication, but I guess I didn't expect that would extend to being cut off from sensing conflict of any kind, especially one as massive as the war. Especially since they had been created as a result of war, to fight for peace.

You'd think their purpose would allow that one exception so they could relax for years until something really big would snap them out and get them ready to fight. But then we wouldn't have the series.
I'm pretty sure no where did it say they had some supernatural ability to sense conflict in the world or tell where Ares was. Being created to fight for peace doesn't mean they have a 'war sense' that tingles every time there's a battle. And they weren't marooned, they were given Themsycira and chose to stay cause it was peaceful. They thought Ares was defeated, and even though they knew there's a chance he'd come back none of them wanted to believe it. The world was at peace then, so they basically retired. And over time chose not to bother with the outside world cause there was no need till it came stomping up on their doorstep. And even then they refused because they'd been set in their ways for so long. Again, that's where Diana comes in as the youthful presence of righteous anger and sense of justice. No doubt there's a trope name for the whole bit, but whatever.

And yes, if the Amazons actually had decided to care about seeing the world outside their bubble things might've been different. On the other hand, maybe not that different but who can say?
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Old June 19th, 2017, 11:50 AM   #646
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I just pictured Diana's head jerking up, eyes wide, with Greek pattern squiggles coming off her head "My fighty sense is tingling!"
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Old June 19th, 2017, 12:59 PM   #647
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Hippolyta is the name. And to be fair, they're Amazons. Really no one expects an answer to why there's no males because they're Amazons and everyone knows they're a group of warrior women. Though on the other side DC I think takes it a step into the fantastical with them practically being a separate race from humans despite obviously looking like them. But really, they're Amazons it's enough.
Oh no, I didn't mean Diana's mother, I meant her sister, the leader of the army etc. She just came across as a total badass, I hope she appears in Justice League. And, just saying "They're Amazons" is enough of an answer for you and me, it may not be the case for the casual audience. They hint with stating that Diana is the only child on the island, many of them never saw a man etc, I just wish they'd have pulled the trigger on a little exposition.

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See I disagree, the color didn't go away at all when they went to London, it just changed. Themyscira was so bloody vibrant because of what it was, a tropical island paradise. It's like living in NY and then looking at Hawaii; there's color in both, they're just different. London was the same, there was still plenty of color, there wasn't any smoke filter or anything it was just some of the colors were more subdued because they were greys, browns, and the like for the buildings and machines but still there. And there was plenty of daylight scenes along with the night scenes towards the end, nothing wrong with that. It wasn't like the whole movie was shot at night like a Batman film or anything.
I disagree, sir, from what we've seen the aesthetic for the DCEU thus far comprises mostly of washed out colours. For example, here's a set photo of when Diana leaves in plain clothes with her sword:



aaaand here's the movie:



Tell me that's not a filter.

I call bullshit on "but that's what colours were there!" argument. Go check Captain America: The First Avenger, it was also set in war-time London.

Here's Wonder Woman in London in Daylight:



and here's Peggy Carter in an underground war bunker:



So yeah, colour, more of it when we're not in Themyscara. Please.

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Old June 19th, 2017, 04:40 PM   #648
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Oh no, I didn't mean Diana's mother, I meant her sister, the leader of the army etc. She just came across as a total badass, I hope she appears in Justice League. And, just saying "They're Amazons" is enough of an answer for you and me, it may not be the case for the casual audience. They hint with stating that Diana is the only child on the island, many of them never saw a man etc, I just wish they'd have pulled the trigger on a little exposition.

I disagree, sir, from what we've seen the aesthetic for the DCEU thus far comprises mostly of washed out colours. For example, here's a set photo of when Diana leaves in plain clothes with her sword:
Amazons were a thing before DC created WW, that was my point. People know about Amazons, even if they don't know specifically about DC's Amazons. So a warrior race of woman, called Amazons, on an island with no men isn't shocking, there's no reason to try and explain the lack of men when you know they're Amazons.

I took 'smoky grey filter' as something different than how the movie actually looks. Yeah, it's not normal lighting but many movies don't use natural lighting. It has more of a subdued color palette, blue sorta, but I don't think there's a lack of color. Themiscrya, as I said, is almost unnaturally vibrant and colorful because it's a solitary island paradise while London's colors are a definite contrast. Basically anywhere would be a contrast to that island. Still, doesn't lack color I just don't see it as a bad thing, it looked perfectly fine.

Using a pic of a purposely well lit confined, underground space to compare with an outdoor shot is a bit odd. It doesn't matter to me how Cap was lit compared to WW, the lighting was fine to me that's really all I wanted to say, I just don't think it lacks color or anything like that.
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Old June 19th, 2017, 08:10 PM   #649
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Hey... so wait... does this movie confirm that Greek Myth creationism is the true origin of life in the DCEU?
Could be ....Of course since we know the Queen didn't tell her everything...They have an out if they have to contradict this later. Since she simplified the story to try and stir her daughter away from becoming a warrior.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 09:24 AM   #650
Matt C
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I call bullshit on "but that's what colours were there!" argument. Go check Captain America: The First Avenger, it was also set in war-time London.

[...]

So yeah, colour, more of it when we're not in Themyscara. Please.
Patty Jenkins and Matthew Jensen specifically set out to avoid the same kind of aesthetic that other period films did (like the gauzy, soft-lit look of The First Avenger). Wonder Woman is a colorful movie, but Patty uses the grimy London/Belgium as a sharp contrast to the colorful paradise of Themiscyra.

The First Avenger's look was just a little diffuse and Steve's outfit should've popped color-wise like Diana's did in the No Man's Land sequence.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 10:06 AM   #651
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It's also telling how the Lasso of Truth still shines a bright golden color no matter the scene.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 02:16 PM   #652
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Wow, that color washing does make a huge difference. I loved how it turned out though. This is the best movie to come from DC since Christopher Nolan's Batman IMO.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 02:17 PM   #653
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It's also telling how the Lasso of Truth still shines a bright golden color no matter the scene.
That's right.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 02:38 PM   #654
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Of course the Amazons couldn't actually kill Aries without Diana...Even if they did go looking for them. The Queen of course wanted none of this.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 04:42 PM   #655
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Not surprising

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment...ry-cavill.html

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'Wonder Woman' proves saving the world isn't just for boys
“Wonder Woman” may have slayed the box office, but Cosmopolitan.com wrote actress Gal Gadot reportedly earned a mere $300,000 for the iconic superhero role.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 05:01 PM   #656
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Wrong.

http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/...r-woman-salary

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It would be perfectly indicative of the gender pay gap that lingers in Hollywood . . . if it were at all true. As the Elle article that sent the stat viral said itself, Cavill’s $14 million earnings include bonuses for box-office performance, while Gadot’s $300,000, per a 2014 Variety report, is just the base salary for each movie she’s made thus far in the DC Universe.

Says a source familiar with both Cavill and Gadot’s contract negotiations, “If you do an apples to apples comparison, she was paid at least as much as he was.”
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Old June 20th, 2017, 05:05 PM   #657
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Yeah, there was a different article that pointed out that, on the first Avengers movie, Chris Evans and Chris Hemsworth were paid about that same amount.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 08:11 PM   #658
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Fox News is unfair and unbalanced, no offense to people who like watching it.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 09:42 PM   #659
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Watching Wonder Woman is like watching Captain America.
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Old June 20th, 2017, 11:39 PM   #660
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Watching Wonder Woman is like watching Captain America.
Stylistically and tonally, yes.
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