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Old July 8th, 2017, 04:28 AM #2081
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Quantum Wolf wrote: View Post

Given that there will be a Who prescense at SDCC, could it be here where they'll reveal the next Doctor?
The details for SDCC's Who panel only seem to gurantee a sneek peek at the Christmas special and a Q and A with the outgoing stars. I doubt they'll want to overshadow Peter's last comic con with news of who's replacing him
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Old July 8th, 2017, 05:45 AM #2082
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Gold Samurai wrote: View Post

He's weaved his way into doctor who fandom with a bunch of things.

Aaah, I remember this video! Plenty of funny moments (Matt, Karen and Arthur were so great together). Wouldn't have remembered Hardwick from it, though.

Quantum Wolf wrote: View Post

Given that there will be a Who prescense at SDCC, could it be here where they'll reveal the next Doctor?
No. No way in sweet hell are they going to announce the new lead of a primetime British TV show to a few thousand fans in an American convention. It needs to be as visible as possible to everyone in the UK, and then anyone who cares to watch in any other country like the US.

Besides, the BBC already got their fingers burnt after they revealed an exclusive 'The Day of the Doctor' trailer at SDCC back in 2013...
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Old July 8th, 2017, 06:31 AM #2083
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Yeah I figured as much that wouldn't be the case. It is admittedly taken for granted that just because of the hugeness of SDCC and worldwide appeal doesn't mean that they'd want to keep the reveal local and likely during a BBC programme.

Sure gonna be odd waking up tomorrow and not watching an episode first thing.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 06:36 AM #2084
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kainhighwind2 wrote: View Post

My issue with Bill was that her entire character was "I'm gay". Aside from that, and she served chips and made a girl fat, I don't know anything else about her.

"generic companion" + "gay" = Bill
I liked Bill ... but there's no denying that he was seriously underdeveloped. I mean, we didn't even get an episode where she goes back and spent time with her mum. For someone who imagined what she'd be like and invented entire conversations with her, you'd think that would be high up on the list of where in time and space you'd want to go.

Her entire home life wasn't developed either. We saw her foster mum, what, twice, briefly? And we had one episode with the not-Class gang in that house.

Most companions go through a transition and you see the change from before and after their experience with the Doctor. That was what was so extremely sad about Donna, when she was never going to remember any of her experiences with the Doctor. But Bill's experiences is largely wrapped up / altered from Heather. I mean, we didn't even get to see her graduate or anything from the Doctor's tutelage.

Granted, this all could have happened if she was kept on, but there was no reason why we couldn't have had this spread throughout the series. Shame.

Clara had a smart mouth, was too clever for her own good, and really managed to get to the nitty gritty of who the Doctor was and what made him tick. Love Clara. Glad she's back for Xmas.
Clara on the other hand, completely overshadowed the Doctor. A feat that not even River Song managed to accomplish! And that's a serious feat!


In any case, I'm definitely ready for the next Doctor and a fresh take on the show.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 06:56 AM #2085
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Bill was definitely undercooked- her Mum was a real missed opportunity. But unfortunately it's a real catch 22- because while it FEELS like we were supposed to have a bigger deal made (the Doc went back and met her!), that she should have got to meet her... we would have found it to be be just another reheated old script- they did it with Pete and Rose in S1 and again in S2.

I WANTED her to meet her mother for REAL- she's a time traveller. Unfortunately, it would have been soured by the been-there-done-thatedness.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 08:15 AM #2086
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Sadsmileyface wrote: View Post

Bill was definitely undercooked- her Mum was a real missed opportunity. But unfortunately it's a real catch 22- because while it FEELS like we were supposed to have a bigger deal made (the Doc went back and met her!), that she should have got to meet her... we would have found it to be be just another reheated old script- they did it with Pete and Rose in S1 and again in S2.

I WANTED her to meet her mother for REAL- she's a time traveller. Unfortunately, it would have been soured by the been-there-done-thatedness.
It's not so much of a catch 22, as even if it retreaded some of the Pete and Rose thing, its been long enough and the context could be different enough to make Bill meeting her mom be different enough. The problem for me was that feeling of it being a bigger deal about her mom, heck, Bill's entire normal life was sort of introduced then tossed aside as unnecessary. Bill just got sort of screwed over as a character and I wish she had gotten to carry over just to see some development flesh out for her.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 08:16 AM #2087
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Bill is generic campanion plus gay? I denno if I should be offended by that assessment or not. Bill is just Bill. We either have a huge backstory and she falls into destiny and people complain or she's just someone who travels with him and people complain.

Bill was definitely underutilized and I'm disappointed in that but I don't need to find out her hobbies or how horrible her life was growing up to appreciate her. I just didn't feel anything here. She was just there. Being stuck in that robot made her too different and then she leaves. I liked the Bill that was ridiculous and said things like the Tardis looked like a kitchen. She should've kept with that view.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 08:23 AM #2088
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That's a wrap for the Moffat era and Capaldi's tenure as The Doctor. Filming of the Christmas special concluded yesterday.

Here's the Golden Wrap video

https://www.instagram.com/p/BWQ6ip9Ftkg/


Christopher Eccelston even sent the crew a video message

https://twitter.com/edwardrussell/st...49021574864896
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Old July 8th, 2017, 08:23 AM #2089
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Bill's sexual orientation doesn't really get mentioned much outside first episode and the "haunted house" one. I don't think it determines her character more than when heterosexuality "defined" Rose, Martha, Donna, Amy...
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:03 AM #2090
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Cameron Samurai wrote: View Post

That's a wrap for the Moffat era and Capaldi's tenure as The Doctor. Filming of the Christmas special concluded yesterday.

Here's the Golden Wrap video

https://www.instagram.com/p/BWQ6ip9Ftkg/


Christopher Eccelston even sent the crew a video message

https://twitter.com/edwardrussell/st...49021574864896
Why would Eccelston do that?
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:09 AM #2091
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hasso_opitz wrote: View Post

Why would Eccelston do that?
A lot of the crew were working on DW when he was in the role, perhaps Eccelston just wanted to wish them well. Despite all the drama about his tenure, there's bound to have been some people he got along with that are still there.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:27 AM #2092
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Cameron Samurai wrote: View Post

A lot of the crew were working on DW when he was in the role, perhaps Eccelston just wanted to wish them well. Despite all the drama about his tenure, there's bound to have been some people he got along with that are still there.
It's still been a long time, and it says it was for Steve wasn't it? Did he do anything like this before when RTD left?

I ask because I hope this means he'll pop up.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:28 AM #2093
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hasso_opitz wrote: View Post

Bill is generic campanion plus gay? I denno if I should be offended by that assessment or not. Bill is just Bill. We either have a huge backstory and she falls into destiny and people complain or she's just someone who travels with him and people complain.
I think its more either the companion is some giant plot device meant to be the biggest most important thing ever, like Clara, or doesn't really get much of an arc outside of "learning about the doctor, specifically things the audience doesn't need a surrogate to know."

You can have a great companion who doesn't need much backstory and its the in the moment that makes them so unique and fun. Donna in the moment is great. Amy and Rory in the moment were great. They didn't need to be wrapped up in a destiny plot device or backstory to make them fun for the ride. Bill was great in the moment, and if they had just left it at that it'd have been fine. But introducing her home life, including her still being somewhat closeted to her foster family, and the accidental mysterious vibe of her mom story, made those feel like dropped storylines for her development, not just pieces of information.

It didn't help she retreaded the Martha storyline, Clara's ending, and spent much of her time just learning about the world of Doctor Who. In the last season of the current Doctor, that story is more in the way than helpful to an audience.

AtoMan wrote: View Post

Bill's sexual orientation doesn't really get mentioned much outside first episode and the "haunted house" one. I don't think it determines her character more than when heterosexuality "defined" Rose, Martha, Donna, Amy...
It's mentioned regularly, but normalized for the most part. She had the running joke about the date in the Monk trilogy and recurring moments of turning down attention from guys in the past. Plus her last words to the Doctor were "You know how I like girls and people my own age?" Which oddly felt like a summary of her backstory as delivered.

Although, heterosexuality did somewhat define Rose and Martha in regards to their relationship to the Doctor being nearly romantic/onesided romantic respectively. Amy and Rory being a hetero married couple is a big defining trait though.

hasso_opitz wrote: View Post

Why would Eccelston do that?
Because he's a decent guy?
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:40 AM #2094
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So people want a Big sweeping arc for Companions or for them just to be people that come along with The Doctor on adventures? Because both seem to displease people.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 09:45 AM #2095
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Bill is just kinda the new Martha to me. Unremarkable and uninteresting, but she doesn't do anything to actively bother me most of the time. I found in scenes she was bouncing off Capaldi they worked well together, and to a lesser extent the same with Nardole. But I didn't really have much interest in her away from them. Though I did feel she really worked well in the 2 part finale, just wish she'd worked as well elsewhere too.

hasso_opitz wrote: View Post

Why would Eccelston do that?
Eccleston has been positive about Moffat in interviews and although he chose not to return the negotiations he had with Moffat for the 50th apparently did go well and Moffat did certain things with the episode to respect his wishes not to return. Given how Eccleston comes across as a person I'm not shocked he'd send a video message.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 10:02 AM #2096
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Titanium321 wrote: View Post

Because he's a decent guy?
He sure is!

I simply ask because it made me think he could be doing something Doctor Whoy. I'd ask the same question to Tennant and he worked with Moffat. My first thought was "hey I was the doctor for a bit, let me congratulate them with a video message 12 years later", so Id hope it was because something was happening we didn't know yet. If it's the same crew but that same crew isn't necessarily changing it just makes me say "why now?". That's all.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 10:05 AM #2097
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hasso_opitz wrote: View Post

If it's the same crew but that same crew isn't necessarily changing it just makes me say "why now?". That's all.
Because now is when Moffat is leaving. It'd be a bit strange to send him a "well done for all the hard work and effort you put into the show, you will be missed" any time before the guy is leaving. It's an after party, you get a lot of things like that going on. It just so happened someone found this specific thing significant enough to tweet out. Wouldn't surprise me to hear there were ones from RTD, Tennant and Smith as well among others.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 10:08 AM #2098
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ZERO_ninja wrote: View Post

Because now is when Moffat is leaving. It'd be a bit strange to send him a "well done for all the hard work and effort you put into the show, you will be missed" any time before the guy is leaving. It's an after party, you get a lot of things like that going on. It just so happened someone found this specific thing significant enough to tweet out. Wouldn't surprise me to hear there were ones from RTD, Tennant and Smith as well among others.
It wasn't supposed to be taken as a negative question. My point is unless I'm missing something it makes me hope he's going to do something and worked with Moffat. I don't know his full history as I've only seen him in 13 Doctor Who episodes in his career and nothing before or after. Sending a guy he didn't work with this video, as far as I know, after 12 years just makes me wonder.
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Old July 8th, 2017, 10:11 AM #2099
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Mhm, perhaps Edward Russell felt it worth mentioning Eccleston because they didn't expect it, but that RTD, Tennant, Smith and others also sent in messages too, unsurprisingly for those attending. I also do wonder if Eccleston's steadily growing more accepting of having been the Doctor - I don't believe he's ever outright hated that he did it, but he's clearly wanted to move on and distance himself from it all to an extent. In the last few years, though, he's talked with Moffat about the prospect of coming back for the 50th, and he helped a Doctor Who fan propose to his girlfriend while semi-in-character. He's definitely getting more relaxed about it.

As to whether he could wind up appearing in the Christmas special or something? Well... does anyone know his thoughts on Rachel Talalay?
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Old July 8th, 2017, 10:13 AM #2100
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kainhighwind2 wrote: View Post

My issue with Bill was that her entire character was "I'm gay". Aside from that, and she served chips and made a girl fat, I don't know anything else about her.

"generic companion" + "gay" = Bill

Clara had a smart mouth, was too clever for her own good, and really managed to get to the nitty gritty of who the Doctor was and what made him tick. Love Clara. Glad she's back for Xmas.
I wouldn't say that was her whole deal, but I gotta agree with others in her being seriously underdeveloped. Like I said yesterday, she basically just felt like she was there to die every few eps then be brought back.
She either died or nearly died (or we were lead to believe she was dead) in what, four of 12 episodes?
"Oxygen"
"Extremis"
"The Lie of the Land"
and the 2-part finale "World and Enough Time" and "The Doctor Falls"

It was just, a boring re-tred. 'Oh no, she's about to die......again. I'm so invested in her b/c she keeps dying.' I found myself laughing in the finale when she makes the Doctor promise to not let her die. Because of course she's going to...again.
I just found myself not caring about her living or not in the finale b/c she had already beaten death a couple times. It felt like the writers kinda wanted to kill her off all season, but didn't have the stones to do so...or were contractually unable to. Either way, it got boring to me.

Xenotome wrote: View Post

He weaves himself into any fandom that'll take his attention because it's his bread and butter.
Is that hint of derision for him? He can be annoying sometimes, but he always seems like a genuine fan of literally everything.
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