Whos going to hell

[Armadastorm]

Based on my studies where all going to hell. Every single last one of us. Even the goodest purest person is going to hell.

[Devious One]

The Bible teaches that only those that choose not to trust Christ is going to hell. But that's been open to debate for many years.

[fireforce]

Hell is gonna be like mass transit, full of shit heads.

[Shadow Slayer]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
Based on my studies where all going to hell. Every single last one of us. Even the goodest purest person is going to hell. Based on my life, we're already there!

[Jspider]

hell is temporary God will simply whipe the evil ones out of existance as it is the only merciful action to take rather then let them hurt themselves/others

[Armadastorm]

The Devious One your still going to hell. See every religion pretty much sayd if you dont worship our god your going to hell. So unless theres a person that celebrate all religions were all going to hell.

[XoticRaven]

I already live in hell, it's called Tucson Arizona.

[Panty Strangled]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
The Devious One your still going to hell. See every religion pretty much sayd if you dont worship our god your going to hell. So unless theres a person that celebrate all religions were all going to hell.

God does'nt exist

[fireforce]

Originally posted by XoticRaven
I already live in hell, it's called Tucson Arizona.


Actually, I think hell is a few degrees cooler.

[XoticRaven]

Originally posted by fireforce
Actually, I think hell is a few degrees cooler.
eh, yes. Very true.

[Claveler]

Originally posted by Zarius
God does'nt exist

According to whom?

[Tyr-El]

If you're taking the Bible as fact, then Hell doesn't exist because the word doesn't appear once in the Bible.

And now is when I should probably point out that I graduated with honour's in Religious Studies. So I have several thick texts backing me up as well as access to people with their doctorate's in Religion.

[Zhoombarango]

Sheol.

[Air Bike Cop]

I don't beleive in hell, along with god. Simple as that.

[OriginalRanger]

Everyone who doesn't believe in Christ is going to hell? Then I guess Gandhi will be burnin' while Hitler's on cloud nine (he was a Christian). Just sick...one would expect a good deity to reward those who do good throughout their lives. So if there be a God and he is in fact good, this would not be true. I doubt a good deity would be in favor of the idea of ETERNAL TORTURE either.

Anyways, I don't believe in hell. It's just a superstition-one of the many underworlds in mythology (ex. the Greek Tartarus). Furthermore, in Norse mythology Loki had a daughter named Hel-familiar name?

Hell is just a myth, and thus is not to be feared.

[OriginalRanger]

There is actually a town named Hell in Norway, though, so in a sense people have gone to hell, and lived there too.

[Claveler]

Originally posted by TranceSephiroth
If you're taking the Bible as fact, then Hell doesn't exist because the word doesn't appear once in the Bible.

Only if you read the English translation.

[puperazzi]

I'll be there, guys! We're gonna have a hell of a time! Woo!

[The Avenging Angel]

If hitler was a christian, and committed this mass atrocity w/o asking for forgiveness, he's probably in Hell, too.;)

[puperazzi]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
If hitler was a christian, and committed this mass atrocity w/o asking for forgiveness, he's probably in Hell, too.;)

Well if that's all it takes, who wants to live in that kind of Heaven? :rolleyes:

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
If hitler was a christian, and committed this mass atrocity w/o asking for forgiveness, he's probably in Hell, too.;)

I'm just talking about Armadastorm's idea of who's going to hell. If only believing in Jesus saves you from hell, than that creates problems (ex. where Hitler and Gandhi would go under this arrangement).

As noted, though, I have no belief in hell. I think there's enough evidence to call it a myth.

[The Avenging Angel]

supposedly, believing in jesus requires you to act more like him, let others see him in you, so hitlet really wasn't the funloving type, lol:D

[Brotha Priest]

um Hell itself isnt mentioned, but this is:

"A place prepared for Satan and his angels"

and also

"A like of fire and damnation"

[Tyr-El]

Well unless you're Satan or one of his angels then I guess you have nothing to worry about.

[Ray-Z]

It's funny how people base their beliefs on some book some guy wrote thousands of years ago.

[Claveler]

Originally posted by TranceSephiroth
Well unless you're Satan...

I knew Ray was going to hell! :D

[OriginalRanger]

In full agreement with Ray's post. People thousands of years ago didn't know as much as people do today.

Here's my evaluation of the "Hell" thing again...

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Everyone who doesn't believe in Christ is going to hell? Then I guess Gandhi will be burnin' while Hitler's on cloud nine (he was a Christian). Just sick...one would expect a good deity to reward those who do good throughout their lives. So if there be a God and he is in fact good, this would not be true. I doubt a good deity would be in favor of the idea of ETERNAL TORTURE either.

Anyways, I don't believe in hell. It's just a superstition-one of the many underworlds in mythology (ex. the Greek Tartarus). Furthermore, in Norse mythology Loki had a daughter named Hel-familiar name?

Hell is just a myth, and thus is not to be feared.

Here's the only "Hell" that exists, people.

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
There is actually a town named Hell in Norway, though, so in a sense people have gone to hell, and lived there too.

[puperazzi]

I believe God and Satan are both giant blue floating heads.

[The Avenging Angel]

Zordon!!!:D

[Poweranimals]

:rolleyes:

[Shadow Slayer]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
Zordon!!!:D And Lokar

[puperazzi]

Originally posted by Shadow Slayer
And Lokar

Just watch out for his wife, I hear she's a real bitch.

[Armadastorm]

i'M SAYING EVEN IF YOU BELIEVE IN JESUS OR THE CHRISTIAN GOD YOU'LL STILL GO TO HELL BECAUSE ANOTHER RELIGION PRACTACLY SAYS YOU DONT BELIEVE IN THIS GOD YOU GO TO HELL MEANING ALL PEOPLE WHO DONT WORSHIP RELIGION A BUT WORSHIP RELIGION B WILL GO TO HELL. aND RELIGION B SAYS THAT IF YOU DONT WORSHIP OUR RELIGION, RELIGION A IS GOING TO HELL. sO BY EACH OTHERS SAYING BOTH GROUPS GO BOTH TO HEAVEN/HELL. SO THAT MEANS THAT WERE ALL DEAD RIGHT NOW BECAUSE HELL COMBINED WITH HEAVEN MEANS EARTH. end caps lock.

[puperazzi]

THAT'S IT! I'M CONVERTING TO BRITNIANITY!

[Panty Strangled]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
i'M SAYING EVEN IF YOU BELIEVE IN JESUS OR THE CHRISTIAN GOD YOU'LL STILL GO TO HELL BECAUSE ANOTHER RELIGION PRACTACLY SAYS YOU DONT BELIEVE IN THIS GOD YOU GO TO HELL MEANING ALL PEOPLE WHO DONT WORSHIP RELIGION A BUT WORSHIP RELIGION B WILL GO TO HELL. aND RELIGION B SAYS THAT IF YOU DONT WORSHIP OUR RELIGION, RELIGION A IS GOING TO HELL. sO BY EACH OTHERS SAYING BOTH GROUPS GO BOTH TO HEAVEN/HELL. SO THAT MEANS THAT WERE ALL DEAD RIGHT NOW BECAUSE HELL COMBINED WITH HEAVEN MEANS EARTH. end caps lock.

GOD DOES NOT EXIST, THERE IS NO HELL, SHUT UP

[Claveler]

Originally posted by Zarius
GOD DOES NOT EXIST, THERE IS NO HELL, SHUT UP

According to whom?

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
i'M SAYING EVEN IF YOU BELIEVE IN JESUS OR THE CHRISTIAN GOD YOU'LL STILL GO TO HELL BECAUSE ANOTHER RELIGION PRACTACLY SAYS YOU DONT BELIEVE IN THIS GOD YOU GO TO HELL MEANING ALL PEOPLE WHO DONT WORSHIP RELIGION A BUT WORSHIP RELIGION B WILL GO TO HELL. aND RELIGION B SAYS THAT IF YOU DONT WORSHIP OUR RELIGION, RELIGION A IS GOING TO HELL. sO BY EACH OTHERS SAYING BOTH GROUPS GO BOTH TO HEAVEN/HELL. SO THAT MEANS THAT WERE ALL DEAD RIGHT NOW BECAUSE HELL COMBINED WITH HEAVEN MEANS EARTH. end caps lock.


Armada, frigging READ MY POSTS. Hell is a myth. Why the hell do you think it's so different from other mythological underworlds?

[Brotha Priest]

People, why did Jesus perform so many miracles back around 10-20 A.D.? So people would believe what he said.

So where are the miracles today? Thats what the Bible is.. the perfect word of God written by people like Paul, Peter, Mark, etc.

The Bible is ment to be our guide on how to live our life.. not only to get to Heaven, but to take as many people as we can with us.

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Brotha Priest
People, why did Jesus perform so many miracles back around 10-20 A.D.? So people would believe what he said.

So where are the miracles today? Thats what the Bible is.. the perfect word of God written by people like Paul, Peter, Mark, etc.

The Bible is ment to be our guide on how to live our life.. not only to get to Heaven, but to take as many people as we can with us.

Oh crap, another religious fanatic trying to convert us...

[Brotha Priest]

I'm not "trying" to do anything.. I'm just stating my part, just like the next "Hell doesn't exsist" guy

chill

[Armadastorm]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Armada, frigging READ MY POSTS. Hell is a myth. Why the hell do you think it's so different from other mythological underworlds?


Wtf do you have prove that there is no hell. No you do not. Maybe there is a hell maybe there isnt. But to religion there is a hell/hades/underword/tartoras/whatever.

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
Wtf do you have prove that there is no hell. No you do not. Maybe there is a hell maybe there isnt. But to religion there is a hell/hades/underword/tartoras/whatever.

Sorry if I sounded goofy; I just misread you earlier. You've got a very good point-we don't know anything. My bad:(. [/B][/QUOTE]

[Ray-Z]

Originally posted by puperazzi
THAT'S IT! I'M CONVERTING TO BRITNIANITY!

Yes, you should all worship the one true goddess.

http://www.britnianity.org

[Tyr-El]

I don't know why I get involved in religious debates online...beyond the fact that it's good practice for debating in university...

That being said...

The word “Hell” never appears within the Bible, but instead, other words have been translated as Hell even if they don’t necessarily refer to a place of fiery judgment. Within the Hebrew Scriptures/Old Testament, a number of references exist to Hell. However, this references are actually translations of the Hebrew word “Sheol”. Sheol is a Hebrew word referring to the Abode of the Dead. It was what existed before God created the world. Everything and everyone that died went to Sheol. It was the Hebrew underworld. There was nothing particularly good or evil about Sheol. It just was. The following passages all refer to Sheol:
- Deut 32:22
- 2Sam 22:6
- Job 11:8
- Job 26:6
- Ps 9:17
- Ps 16:10
- Ps 18:5
- Ps 55:15
- Ps 86:13
- Ps 116:3
- Ps 139:8
- Prov 5:5
- Prov 7:27
- Prov 9:18
- Prov 15:11
- Prov 15:24
- Prov 23:14
- Prov 27:20
- Is 5:14
- Is 14:9
- Is 14:15
- Is 28:15
- Is 28:18
- Is 57:9
- Eze 31:16
- Eze 31:17
- Eze 32:21
- Eze 32:27
- Amos 9:2
- Jonah 2:2
- Hab 2:5

Within the Christian Scriptures/New Testament, there are no references to Sheol because the New Testament was originally written in Greek. As such, the Greek word “Hades” is used instead. In Greek mythology, Hades referred to the place of the dead. It was the place all dead people went. There was no distinction between a good place (like Heaven) and a bad place (like Hell). It simply was. It is essentially the same as the Hebrew Sheol. The following are references to Hades:
- Mt 11:23
- Mt 16:18
- Lk 10:15
- Lk 16:23
- Acts 2:27
- Acts 2:31
- Jas 3:6
- Rev 1:18
- Rev 6:8
- Rev 20:13
- Rev 20:14

In the Gospels there are also references to “Gehenna” as opposed to Hades. Gehenna is Greek for “Valley of Hinnom”, a valley outside of Jerusalem. It was a trash dump, where fires were constantly burning to ward of disease and the smell. Dead bodies, particularly of criminals, were frequently tossed into Gehenna as well to dispose of. As a result, Gehenna was associated with a fiery place of judgment for the wicked. It became a place of threat. If you weren’t careful, you’d be thrown into Gehenna. However, there is nothing in the Bible that implies any sort of torment in Gehenna. This was a later view arising from medieval times. The following are references to Gehenna:
- Mt 5:22
- Mt 5:29
- Mt 5:30
- Mt 10:28
- Mt 18:9
- Mt 23:15
- Mt 23:33
- Mk 9:43
- Mk 9:45
- Mk 9:47
- Lk 12:5
- Lk 16:23

There is also one reference to “Tartarus” within the Epistles. Tartarus was a prison in Greek mythology, deep beneath Hades, where only the especially wicked went. For the most part, it was monsters that were confined to Tartarus such as Titans. In the Bible, the only beings confined to Tartarus are Lucifer and his Fallen Angels.
- 2Pet 2:4

[Brotha Priest]

crap your good trance... I was just typing those up... not that big of a list though :p

[deacon shields]

trance is a god in religious discussion. there is no telling how many people he has busted down on here (not to mention him helping me with angel stuff).

[Tyr-El]

Heh, thanks ^_^

Seriously, I've got a book case behind me filled with research texts on religion. And anything I don't have here, I can just get from university. I <3 grad studies ^_^

Oh, and for the record, I already had that Hell list saved...from the last time I needed it :D

[Red TF Ranger]

"For God so loved the world,he gave his only begotten son,and whomever believe in Him shall not perish,but have everlasting life"
John 3:16

If you believe,and you`ve accepted the Lord,you`re going to Heaven.....

[Darky]

Originally posted by Shadow Slayer
Based on my life, we're already there!

Here here!

But seriously, I believe you'll only go to Hell if you're an evil, insidious person, or don't believe in the Faith.

Trance even said that Satan himself isn't even said in the Bible. But it does say the Devil quite a bit, which I believe to be Lucifer/Satan/etc, and it does mention the Beast

[Tyr-El]

Within the Hebrew Bible, there are references to adversarial angels, designated by the title satan (“adversary”). Under the influence of Zoroastrianism, the satan became Satan, the great Adversary of God. While he does not play a role as supreme agent of evil within the Hebrew Bible, within the Christian Testament Satan is envisioned as an angel fallen from grace, determined to spite God for his fall. A common name for Satan in the Christian Bible is Devil, stemming from the Greek diabolos (“slanderer”), the equivalent Greek term to the Hebrew satan.

So yeah, Satan isn't a name, it's a title. And most of the satans in the Hebrew Bible are good guys. Sometimes Satan is interchangable with Angel of the Lord (Numbers 22 for example). In Job, where Satan comes off as being "bad", anything he does is because God lets him.

[PurpleWindRangr]

This is so stupid. Why post a thread that brings such debate. Though I am replying so I guess I'm stupid too...anyway..

In my faith (I don't use the word "religion") I don't believe in satan/devil or hell. I believe God is an all loving God and that we create our own "hell" so to speak with our own karma. That is you pay for the pain you have caused when you die then once your spirit comes to terms with it you move on to "heaven" or "Summerland" or whatever you choose to call it. Anyway I could go on but A) I'm tired and B) I doubt anyone cares.

[Poweranimals]

:rolleyes:

[greenstranger]

Yeah I'm going to hell, Then I can beat up Hitler:D

[IvyDraken]

Originally posted by Armadastorm
The Devious One your still going to hell. See every religion pretty much sayd if you dont worship our god your going to hell. So unless theres a person that celebrate all religions were all going to hell.

Just to tell you... I've studied every religion on the map that is known and most of them actually do not condemn others for different beliefs. It's the zealots that take it a step too far. The religions themselves do not condemn others to hell. Jesus never did. People with their imperfect nature want to believe that they are better than anyone else so they construct an elite group that allows them to think that they are superior. Isn't it funny how we are all probably on the same level....an equal plane of existence...

[JediMB]

When I die, I will rot for many long years until I have finally become one with the Earth once again.

[navyranger]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Everyone who doesn't believe in Christ is going to hell? Then I guess Gandhi will be burnin' while Hitler's on cloud nine (he was a Christian).

Just cause someone says they're a christian doesn't mean they are.

[Darky]

Hitler wasn't a Christian, he killed Jews and Catholics for God's sakes. Oh yeah, I'm a Christian, when I'll burn a shitload of Bibles and Catholics and breaks about 4/5 of the Bible's rules

[ZeoRed]

there is a big diffrence in saying your a christain and living like one. hitler was a dumbass. Like Zaruis he thinks god dosnt exsist. so really what this all boils down to is this. everyone on earth will believe how they want to beleive weather or not its the right way. I am a baptist christain and i will remain that way until the day i die and i have strong rock hard faith that jesus will be waiting for me on the other side when my time has come. I know some of you might flame me for what i just said but i dont care. I am who i am and i beleive how i beleive. but deep down inside i think we all have the one thing that god told us to have FAITH thats what keeps me beleiving thats what keeps me worshipping jesus and god . nothing will ever change that.

[Tyr-El]

"God is dead" - Nietzsche

"Nietzsche is dead" - God

[Poweranimals]

:rolleyes:

[OriginalRanger]

Religion is neither about peace nor about war. All's it's about is saving yourself from percieved miserable fate (burning in hell, rebirth into a cruel world, etc.). Religion does not make someone moral.

[ThinkPink]

ZeoRed: I applaud you for your courage to stand up and state your faith so firmly. I don't think that you should be flamed because you are only stating what you believe to be true about this topic...just like those who say "there is no god" or "we're all going to hell" or "it doesn't exist" or whatever. Well put.

[ZeoRed]

Thank you ThinkPink i appreciate that which you have stated. OriginalRanger I agree with some of what you said just becacuse you go to church and study a certain religon dosnt mean that you are a moral person I knew a preacher that ran off with a women 20 years younger than him he left behind a wife and 3 kids you know what they did? they forgave him. why you ask? because they felt that it was the right thing to do weather he was in the wrong or not. and i personaly thing he was. It all depends on the type of person you are as far as being moral goes. But no oneis perfect.

[Mew2Too]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Everyone who doesn't believe in Christ is going to hell? Then I guess Gandhi will be burnin' while Hitler's on cloud nine (he was a Christian).

That's a big crock o' shit! Hitler was no Christian - in fact it is said he may have been a Satanist. He hid behind Catholicism in order to hook certain groups on his idea.

Hitler was obviously not repentant for his actions in the end. He skulked in a little bunker beneath his castle, then shot himself. He was a coward. Had he been truly repentant, he would have chosen to help the Jews rebuild - no matter how hard that might have been for either side to accept.

And Ghadndi WAS a Christian - at least in the sense that he followed in many of the character traits that Christ himself took on. And, to be a "born-again" Christian, all one must do is follow in the ways of Christ's compassion and accept his sacrafice actually was for the forgiveness of our sins. There isn't really any other criteria for being a Christian than that. (At least, none that I know of.)

So, we know Ghandi was at least part of the way there, right? In fact, several times in his life, he cited the life of Christ as an inspiration to him. So, who knows?

[Mew2Too]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Religion is neither about peace nor about war. All's it's about is saving yourself from percieved miserable fate (burning in hell, rebirth into a cruel world, etc.). Religion does not make someone moral.

And THAT is correct. In fact, Christ shunned religion. Instead, he encouraged his followers to be peaceful, accepting, and compassionate to ALL people. He despised the predjudiced, the hateful, the murderous.

[Poweranimals]

Wow, someone who actually has it right.

[Kamen R2J]

Here's how it goes down:

You do good, you got to heaven, live peacefully.

Do bad, you'll be wearing red for the rest of your life...and be tortured.

You don't beleive in God, don't do bad, the who's up for a game of limbo?

Beleive in another kind of Religion that was bulit by itself and performed no miracles, I *think* you go to Hell, but for the fun of it, like Britnianity, then that's ok, cause you are just doing it for fun.

I beleive if you do certain bad things, there are punishments you have to do. If you commit suicide, I think you are stuck in a tree, and if you break a branch, then I think the tree or you bleeds. I dunno.

Anyway, that's just my 2 cents. Now what to do with the other 5............

[Poweranimals]

Originally posted by RedPwr124x
Here's how it goes down:

You do good, you got to heaven, live peacefully.

Do bad, you'll be wearing red for the rest of your life...and be tortured.

You don't beleive in God, don't do bad, the who's up for a game of limbo?

Beleive in another kind of Religion that was bulit by itself and performed no miracles, I *think* you go to Hell, but for the fun of it, like Britnianity, then that's ok, cause you are just doing it for fun.

I beleive if you do certain bad things, there are punishments you have to do. If you commit suicide, I think you are stuck in a tree, and if you break a branch, then I think the tree or you bleeds. I dunno.

Anyway, that's just my 2 cents. Now what to do with the other 5............ no

[Kamen R2J]

yes

[Mew2Too]

Originally posted by RedPwr124x
Here's how it goes down:

You do good, you got to heaven, live peacefully.

Do bad, you'll be wearing red for the rest of your life...and be tortured.

You don't beleive in God, don't do bad, the who's up for a game of limbo?

Beleive in another kind of Religion that was bulit by itself and performed no miracles, I *think* you go to Hell, but for the fun of it, like Britnianity, then that's ok, cause you are just doing it for fun.

I beleive if you do certain bad things, there are punishments you have to do. If you commit suicide, I think you are stuck in a tree, and if you break a branch, then I think the tree or you bleeds. I dunno.

Anyway, that's just my 2 cents. Now what to do with the other 5............

Pardon me for being very un-Christianlike, but...

http://www.wackyweaselworld.com/gamespot/flameINC/WTF2.jpg

[Commax]

Have any of you seen Dogma? That movie kicked ass.

[Deathblack]

Everybody will find out when they die. Beleive what you want to beleive. It's your call. Some people are starting to beleive hell is just you alone in nothing but darkness and all you can hear is your breathing.

[Darky]

Good interpretation of Ghandi.

Jesus believed in Judaism, He was Jewish. He just didn't like the killers, prejudiced, hateful, etc as pointed out

[Remix]

Dude! You can't find out if you're going to hell or heaven unless you're still alive when they buried you or when you are supposedly dead. All these facinations about heaven being so pure and clean and hell being so dark and evil is all but a mere fact.

People can't just die and go to heaven or hell and expects us to believe it. A Religion is something you believe in and in its whole entireity. It's a choice. You believe in one God, then fine. You don't care about the other Religions but simply respect them.

So in other words, here it is:

Heaven and Hell exists only if you choose to believe they do. I'm a Christian and I know I have done some sinful things throughout my life, but I also know that in one way or another, I'm going to Hell first then when I'm done repenting my sins and doing my time there, I know God would forgive my sorry ass and let me inside his almighty kingdom.

But - I'm not dead yet, so Britnianity 4EVER!

[The Avenging Angel]

Dogma was supposed to be a commentary on religion and society, i read somewhere...

some people believe that hell isn't fire and brimstone, but different for every person, the main concensus is that hell is dark because the only way you can trap an angel (a fallen one, in this case) is in darkness...

we'll all find out when we die, i guess...not looking forward to it though;)

[Edge of De Wall]

Here's the thing about Chirstanity:

God loves no matter what. Jesus died for the sins of the people in Christanity faith(or mythology.) and suffered through hell so no one wil go again.

So God loves you...no matter what you do, he will remain a loving father type figure..

BUT

BUT the catch is WILL YOU EXPECT GOD?

Thats what Chirtanity is, the expentence that there is a God.

[Commax]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
Dogma was supposed to be a commentary on religion and society, i read somewhere...



Dogma was a kick ass movie about the last scion's quest to stop two fallen angels from reentering Heaven. People condemn the flick because it makes a mockery out of Catholicism. Kevin Smith, the director, is a Catholic. Plus it stars Jay and Silent Bob, so it's funny as shit.

[Zhoombarango]

:: starts singing Voltaire ::

God thinks, all blacks are obsolete farm equipment.
God thinks, the Jews killed his son and must be punished.
And God thinks, the white man is Satan.
God, they know what God thinks.

God thinks, we should all convert to Judaism.
God thinks, we must all be Christians.
And God thinks, we should all embrace Islam.
God thinks the only true religion is Hinduism.

And I, I know what God thinks, God thinks you're a waste of flesh.
Oh oh, God prefers an atheist.
Oh oh, God. God.

God thinks all people like you are hateful.
God thinks all people like you are an embarrassment to creation.
Self-righteous, judgemental, first to throw the stone.
Using his name, for your own protection.

God thinks, the Sun revolves around the Earth.
God thinks, there was something very wrong with Copernicus.
God thinks, abortion is murder.
And God thinks, everything that science gave us is wrong.

God thinks, women deserve it.
God thinks, AIDS is a form of punishment.
I hate people who blame the devil for their own shortcomings.
And I hate people who thank God when things go right.

And I, I know what God thinks, God thinks you're an idiot.
Oh oh, God prefers a heretic.
Oh oh, God. God.

God thinks all people like you are hateful.
God thinks all people like you are an embarrassment to creation.
Self-righteous, judgemental, first to throw the stone.
And you're using his name, for your own agenda.

Oh oh oh oh...

God is a Liberal, God is a Democrat, God wants you to vote Republican.
Never trust a man who puts his words in the mouth of God, and says it's absolute truth.
It's lies and it smells like death.
And it's all in a day's work taking money from the poor.
Why do you think that god would need your dirty money if he wanted to start a holy war?

Self-righteous, judgmental, first to throw the stone.
And you're using his name for your own protection.

God thinks puppies need to die.
And God thinks babies need to drown.
Cause God is neither good nor bad.
God is you and me.
God is everything.


:: smiles and laughs :: That first line practically made me one of his fans.

For the life of me, though, I can't understand why the thought of living forever in Paradise is so...icky...to some.

[Natinspace]

Originally posted by zyuray
It's funny how people base their beliefs on some book some guy wrote thousands of years ago.

First off, a bunch of guys wrote it, yet the theology remains consistent throughout the book. You would think a book written over thousands of years would contradict itself on a major scale, but the Bible doesn't.

Second, its the number one selling book of all time. Thats got to be saying something about its relevance to our lives. People have been trying to get rid of it for years, but have come up unsuccessful.

Even if you don't believe all the theology in it, you've got to admit that the morals are good to live by. Heck, our own justice system was loosely based on the Ten Commandments.

[Tyr-El]

Originally posted by Natinspace
You would think a book written over thousands of years would contradict itself on a major scale, but the Bible doesn't.

You mean beyond there being four different stories of the same guy's life with different things happening each time?

Or beyond the universe being created twice?

[Natinspace]

Originally posted by TranceSephiroth
You mean beyond there being four different stories of the same guy's life with different things happening each time?

Or beyond the universe being created twice?

To my knowledge, the gospels never contradicted each other. you could cite the different "Sermon on the Mount"s, but Jesus told the sermon more than one time, changing it subtly to speak more to the people he was talking to.

Each gospel told of a different part of Christ's life, emphasizing different aspects. They don't have to be carbon copies of each other.

I don't know whatcha mean by the universe being created twice, though.

[Tyr-El]

Genesis 1 details the creation of the universe. The Lord slowly creates the world, first forming the world, then adding birds, fish, animals, plants, and finally he creates man and woman at the same time, before resting

And then we have a second creation account where Adam is created, then all the animals, and the finally woman is created and is less than man. Despite the fact that a chapter earlier it stated that they were created equal.

I call that a pretty big contradiction.

[Edge of De Wall]

I would have to say that I could care?
Why? I became an anthisit because religion itself is a restrain on the human. There is no real point to religion, at least thats what I think.
We are born, and we will die. Wither or not there is an afterlife is something unknown, for no one has ever came back from the DEAD to report what was there.

[Natinspace]

Originally posted by TranceSephiroth
Genesis 1 details the creation of the universe. The Lord slowly creates the world, first forming the world, then adding birds, fish, animals, plants, and finally he creates man and woman at the same time, before resting

And then we have a second creation account where Adam is created, then all the animals, and the finally woman is created and is less than man. Despite the fact that a chapter earlier it stated that they were created equal.

I call that a pretty big contradiction.

After re-reading Genesis 1 and 2, I see what you're talking about. But I believe the second account is simply a restatement of how God formed the creatures before they came to be named by Adam.

It also seems that the account in Genesis 1 was quickly stated, whereas Genesis 2 elaborates. In the first chapter, it simply stated that man and woman were created. In chapter 2, as I said, it elaborates on how they were created. Woman was created to be a "help" to man. How would that make her less of a person? She's been given a lot of responsibility.

[JediMB]

Originally posted by Darky
Hitler wasn't a Christian, he killed Jews and Catholics for God's sakes.
Plus, he was planning to go after the Christians later, since Jesus was a Jew.


Anyway, my opinion on religion is... that it is all about finding a place in the world. Not only for yourself, but for the human race in whole. It is also about explaining what by other means can/could not be explained -- spreading light in the darkness.

[JediMB]

Originally posted by Natinspace
Woman was created to be a "help" to man. How would that make her less of a person? She's been given a lot of responsibility.
And that would mean that the women live for the men, and not for themselves. At least that's one way to interpret it.

[Mew2Too]

Originally posted by blackbird_1.0
some people believe that hell isn't fire and brimstone, but different for every person, the main concensus is that hell is dark because the only way you can trap an angel (a fallen one, in this case) is in darkness...

Ah, but darkness is where light can shine the brightest. Darkness can let us gaze upon the beauty of starlight. Darkness brings about a breeze that cools. Darkness brings a chance to sleep, a chance to dream...

Hell is full of light. Lucifer was an Angel of Light. But the light there is a blazing red, it burns the eyes - both literally and figuratively.

Darkness can be cooling, light can be scorching. No, I disagree. Hell is full of fire, and it tortures the eyes for eternity. Heaven is peaceful, cooling, calm... Dark! A beautiful sunset forrest full of streams, trees, and pebbled earth.

...
...

I think I've just inspired myself to create a new StyleXP visual style. :D

[Nightcrawler]

Whoa! Good thing I'm a Jew and there is no Hell for me! That would suck!

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by Natinspace
To my knowledge, the gospels never contradicted each other. you could cite the different "Sermon on the Mount"s, but Jesus told the sermon more than one time, changing it subtly to speak more to the people he was talking to.

Each gospel told of a different part of Christ's life, emphasizing different aspects. They don't have to be carbon copies of each other.

I don't know whatcha mean by the universe being created twice, though.

Yeah but also you gotta know that there are contradictions ie. matthews and lukes geneology of Jesus. Who should the chrstians convert, matthew says Jews first, Paul say jews first. Mark said go to everyone and andrew said israel is lost dont waste time on them.

[Sonic Ranger 1]

I know I am going to hell I am the spawn of satinI know I am going to hell I am the spawn of satin

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Natinspace
Woman was created to be a "help" to man. How would that make her less of a person? She's been given a lot of responsibility.


The myth of Adam and Eve serves to promote a system of patriarchy. In ancient Israelite society, women were basically valued only as property (the legendary King Solomon supposedly had as many wives, concubines, and lovers as Scherazade had tales! In other words, 1001). For woman to be created to "help" man means that she wasn't made to live life for herself, but was instead made to live her life for man, and such logic is incompatiable with modern thinking.

Supporting the Adam and Eve myth's demeaning of women is an earlier version involving Lilith, Adam's first wife who was made at the same time as him. Lilith had a problem with Adam's wanting to control her, so she left. So God, in the story, made Eve who WAS submissive, and Lilith became a demon in mythology.

Forgetting the Lilith version and jumping to the present-day one, Adam and Eve's problem is that it assumes "man" and "woman" to be completely separate creatures, which they are not. "Man" and "woman" are just male and female humans, no more separate than male and female mice are. "Males" and "females" have to exist at the SAME TIME because both are needed for reproduction. So Adam, a man, had his private parts but he had no woman to have sex with. So, we are left with the image of Adam "harassing" goats and sheep trying to figure out what to do with his naughty bits-a very sick thought indeed!

Also a problem is the dinosaurs. According to the Adam and Eve myth, all life was created in six days! So the dinosaurs died out in one day!? They ruled the Earth much longer than humans have. And how come, if all life originated in the same place (the "Garden of Eden") are there species of animals only indigenous to Australia (ex. kangaroos, platypuses). There are far too many inconsistencies with current scientific knowledge that this story cannot be true. And I won't even go into all the inbreeding in the Adam and Eve family.

So, Adam and Eve is a myth created to justify a patriarchal society. To help achieve gender equality, both males and females must throw off its shackles.

[Darky]

Easy the dinosaurs were animals too that eventually died out.

Now you're saying religion is sexist because it says women were to help men? Without women we couldn't reproduce, and we'd be lonely, without women, we wouldn't have help and companionship. Damn I don't know wtf your problem is.

I have seen proof that Jesus existed, I have seen and heard of proof that Noah's Ark existed, etc

[YellowRangerBoy]

I'm not very religious, but I want to speak on this issue. As far as the discussion on hell, the Scriptures define hell, or Sheol or Hades, as "mandkind's common grave". Nowhere does it actually say that hell is a literal place of torment, but more than once, it's actually mentioned as a place of inactivity. Also, once you die, you are cleared of all sins (See Romans 6:23), so there's no reason to be tormented after death.

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
According to the Adam and Eve myth, all life was created in six days!

I think this is where people get confused. In biblical terms, a day actually means a time period, not necessarily 24 hours.

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Darky
Easy the dinosaurs were animals too that eventually died out.

Now you're saying religion is sexist because it says women were to help men? Without women we couldn't reproduce, and we'd be lonely, without women, we wouldn't have help and companionship. Damn I don't know wtf your problem is.

I have seen proof that Jesus existed, I have seen and heard of proof that Noah's Ark existed, etc


Rediculous hack pseudoscience proof that Noah's Ark existed, I gather. How is EVERY SPECIES of animal going to fit onto ONE BOAT (I don't know about the EXACT # of animal species, but I think its obvious that it goes into tens of thousands. And what of the plants?)? If Noah's Ark was in fact proved to be true, it would be the archeological find of the century, but that find and the resulting hoopla hasn't happened. And the Noah story just has too much riding against it.

Flood stories exist around the world, but that is no doubt due to the fact that the first civilizations all grew up on river valleys (some examples: the Tigris and Euphrates in Mesopotamia (Iraq), the Indus in India, the Nile in Egypt, and the Huang Ho in China)-the valleys would of course overflow, and ancient peoples would say that the God/the Gods were angry, because that was how they explained everything, lacking the scientific knowledge to do otherwise.

Ex. the Sumerians of Iraq, the first major civilization, predated the Israelites as a culture and had a flood myth with THEIR gods. So you could make the argument that the Sumerian myth is the right one, as it came first. But again, the river valleys thing.

Jesus was most likely a real person, but whether or not he was the son of God is a matter of faith. I won't take a side either way on this one.

The Adam and Eve story is sexist because it says that women are there to "help men" but men aren't there to "help women." Again, re-read my breakdown of the myth in my last post. Men lorded it over women in ancient Israelite society. Many cultures had an anti-women creation myth (ex. Pandora's Box in Greece), as patriarchal societies were very widespread.

A day as a time period-the number of yrs in a time period is obviously uneven. The fifth day (life created) lasted FAR LONGER than the sixth (humans showed up). Life before humans was a period of 100s of millions of years, and humans have been around for I'm guessing over 300,000. So the sixth and seventh blew by quick. Could this be a problem?

[Red TF Ranger]

Originally posted by ZeoRed
there is a big diffrence in saying your a christain and living like one. hitler was a dumbass. Like Zaruis he thinks god dosnt exsist. so really what this all boils down to is this. everyone on earth will believe how they want to beleive weather or not its the right way. I am a baptist christain and i will remain that way until the day i die and i have strong rock hard faith that jesus will be waiting for me on the other side when my time has come. I know some of you might flame me for what i just said but i dont care. I am who i am and i beleive how i beleive. but deep down inside i think we all have the one thing that god told us to have FAITH thats what keeps me beleiving thats what keeps me worshipping jesus and god . nothing will ever change that.
I agree with you 110%,my friend

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Rediculous hack pseudoscience proof that Noah's Ark existed, I gather. How is EVERY SPECIES of animal going to fit onto ONE BOAT, Jesus was most likely a real person, but whether or not he was the son of God is a matter of faith. I won't take a side either way on this one.

He did not take one of every species...Only one of every kind of animal. ie. one canine through wich wolves, coyotes and dogs came out of etc. he did not take any bugs or sea animals, plus Noach was like 600 years old already or something so he probably took babies because he was a drift for a year so if he took an old animal it might have died in that time. Just think about it and it will make sense

And as for Jesus there is no documentation of his existance outside of Christianity. Considering it was only 2,000 years ago and the importance of his existance to non-chrsitian societies, ie. Judea, and Rome, I am suprised that there was not one letter of report ever made about him, looks like no one even noticed him

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Phalko
He did not take one of every species...Only one of every kind of animal. ie. one canine through wich wolves, coyotes and dogs came out of etc. he did not take any bugs or sea animals, plus Noach was like 600 years old already or something so he probably took babies because he was a drift for a year so if he took an old animal it might have died in that time. Just think about it and it will make sense

Of course Noah wouldn't have had sea animals. But even without bugs, he still would have had a TON of animals. There are thousands upon thousands of species out there. Not to mention you completely missing my point about there being some species only occuring in Australia.

And I think it's worth it to ask how someone could live to be over 600 in an extremely unadvanced time without modern medicine or know anything about how to treat diseases. If living in a primitive enviornment makes you last longer, then why did humans have to invent medicines? Just a thought.

[The Avenging Angel]

i don't think you'd need aquatic animals since they could always come up for air, so basically air and land creatures

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Of course Noah wouldn't have had sea animals. But even without bugs, he still would have had a TON of animals. There are thousands upon thousands of species out there. Not to mention you completely missing my point about there being some species only occuring in Australia.

And I think it's worth it to ask how someone could live to be over 600 in an extremely unadvanced time without modern medicine or know anything about how to treat diseases. If living in a primitive enviornment makes you last longer, then why did humans have to invent medicines? Just a thought.

But people did live longer in the past. It was already proven that a tribe living a small village in Yemen had an average age of 180 years and their oldest living person was 203, but shortley after their discovery approx 25 years their age dropped from outside influence. Plus look at most of the diseases we have now. They came from our interactions with each other, every area had their diseases but the people of that region were immune until they traveled our travelers came to them and spread it to those whose systems were not able to fend off the alien bactieria/virus. Plus acient man was more inteligent than we are today. Look at the great pyramid in egypt, or stonehenge. Scientists today cant figure out how that stuff was done. And the earth is only about 6,000 years old. atmospheric radiactive carbon proves that it is less than 10,00 years old but most scientific journals do not like to advertize these things very much as their publications are built around the theories of evolution and the big bang. Safely to say if you ask most scientists if they "beleive" in evolution they will say no. I am a bioanalytical chemist and work with other scientists and physicists and most think all that is plain bull shit.

[Darky]

Originally posted by Phalko
He did not take one of every species...Only one of every kind of animal. ie. one canine through wich wolves, coyotes and dogs came out of etc. he did not take any bugs or sea animals, plus Noach was like 600 years old already or something so he probably took babies because he was a drift for a year so if he took an old animal it might have died in that time. Just think about it and it will make sense

And as for Jesus there is no documentation of his existance outside of Christianity. Considering it was only 2,000 years ago and the importance of his existance to non-chrsitian societies, ie. Judea, and Rome, I am suprised that there was not one letter of report ever made about him, looks like no one even noticed him

Correct. Besides, there's evolution, so some animals that are around now probably didn't exist back then.

The Romans supposedly had documents about Jesus, I think Trance said that months ago. Only they didn't call Him Jesus, they called him by a Roman name which translated to Jesus in Middle Eastern language.

And yes, ppl could live longer before the Europeans settled in other lands. Diseases brought about an end to such a long life span for many. Before that ppl could live to be about 180 or so. I believe that maybe since there was so much evil in Europe at the time with greed and the way the Roman empire acted, etc, maybe disease was brought down as a punishment. And what about Moses? Aren't there accounts of Egypt once owning Jewish slaves, and all of a sudden they're gone? I'm not sure, but hasn't that been proven?

[OriginalRanger]

Originally posted by Phalko
And the earth is only about 6,000 years old. atmospheric radiactive carbon proves that it is less than 10,00 years old

Suuuure...Kent Hovind loving crackpot.

Do you have a website? Here's a good place you can get it linked at: www.crank.net.


The problem with religious fanatics is that they obsess over trying to prove that THEIR story is right. If history turned out different people would be trying to prove that a God named Mithras really DID kill a special bull, purifying the world's soil.

Let's face evidence, the Israelites of thousands of years ago were a primitive people without much knowledge on how the world worked. And certainly not as advanced in rational thinking as the Greeks. Instead of just automatically believing in something some people did 2000 years ago, wouldn't it be great if people would learn to question things.

[Pixel312]

FACT: Human beings were created perfect by God.
FACT: Satan, in Eden, tricked the first humans into sinning.
FACT: Humans sinned, so were no longer perfect.
FACT: The price of sin is eternity in Hell. So all are doomed to Hell.
FACT: Instead of making us all go to Hell, God gave us a way out,
and sent his own kid to die in our place.
FACT: We all can accept this gift, but most don't because they
it is a burden, while actually it is freedom. Dude, it's worth
it. Would you rather burn for eternity of be in Heaven.
Sheesh. Big duh.


If you have any questions, my AIM screen name is Pixel312. MSN Messenger is bonafidebeliever03@hotmail.com. Yahoo messenger, unglebungle87.

Remember Titus 3:5. "Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy, He saved us through the washing of regeneration and the renewal of the Holy Spirit."

Basically, we can do all the good we want, but we still sin, so we're doomed for Hell, but if you just accept the gift and get saved, you're just that, saved. So get a clue people and get saved! God isn't some dumb supernatural police cop who wants to strike you down with lightning every time you die, He loves you and hates that most everybody crapping on themselves with lies about how He isn't for them. God is love. Never forget that.

[OriginalRanger]

My final thoughts:

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
The problem with religious fanatics is that they obsess over trying to prove that THEIR story is right. If history turned out different people would be trying to prove that a God named Mithras really DID kill a special bull, purifying the world's soil.

Let's face evidence, the Israelites of thousands of years ago were a primitive people without much knowledge on how the world worked. And certainly not as advanced in rational thinking as the Greeks. Instead of just automatically believing in something some people did 2000 years ago, wouldn't it be great if people would learn to question things.


This threads gone to hell. I will post no more here.

[Camigwen]

Originally posted by Darky
And what about Moses? Aren't there accounts of Egypt once owning Jewish slaves, and all of a sudden they're gone? I'm not sure, but hasn't that been proven?
Nope. There is not record of Moses in Egyptian historical findings. The Hebrew slaves supossedly build the pyramids, but all findings say that the people of Egypt willing aided Pharaoh in building them.

Originally posted by Pixel312
FACT: Human beings were created perfect by God.
FACT: Satan, in Eden, tricked the first humans into sinning.
FACT: Humans sinned, so were no longer perfect.
FACT: The price of sin is eternity in Hell. So all are doomed to Hell.
FACT: Instead of making us all go to Hell, God gave us a way out,
and sent his own kid to die in our place.
FACT: We all can accept this gift, but most don't because they
it is a burden, while actually it is freedom. Dude, it's worth
it. Would you rather burn for eternity of be in Heaven.
Sheesh. Big duh.
These are only facts if your a Chrisitian. I am not a Christian, so to me, these are all false.

And--not meaning to offend anyone--Christians live their whole lives striving to be perfect in an imperfect world.

I like my religion: Live life while your here and make it worth while. It's about living life up to its fullest potential and doing the things that you wanna do and the things that make you happy, not the things that a supreme being believes you should do.

..just my opinion.

[fireforce]

Damn this shit is STILL going on?!?

[PinkAngel]

Originally posted by Camigwen
Christians live their whole lives striving to be perfect in an imperfect world.

I think most religions strive that. Buddhism, Hinduism...Whatever. They want to reach nirvana and be stripped off of human condition.

Originally posted by Camigwen
I like my religion: Live life while your here and make it worth while. It's about living life up to its fullest potential and doing the things that you wanna do and the things that make you happy...

It's not that much diff. from any other religions out there. It's about living life to the fullest. End of story.

[Pixel312]

Ok, I need to get something straight with everybody, because I see this way too often on the net. There is no common personality within Christians. Christians are not perfect. All Christians aren't perfect little snot-nosed son-of-a-guns who think they're better than everyone else. In fact, if there, are then they're probably not truly Christians. A Christian is a plain-old dude who had been saved. A Christian could've murdered a person, robbed a bank, slapped a baby, kicked an old lady, masturbated three times a day, whatever. A Christian is a plain person. The only difference is that they're going to Heaven. Christianity is not reserved for "good people". There is no such thing. It's for people who are sick of living a sick stupid lie. Please never say it's not for you. That's like saying "Ok, well, it's great that you just let yourself get beat to death for me, but um, you did it for no reason. No thanks." So you say sorry you died and all, but make it in vain? How could you do that to a person? How could you do that to Jesus? He's not mythological. He's not just a Santa Claus coming to bring all the little kiddies Bible stories. He's saved my life and he could save yours. I don't want you who haven't felt the change to find out the hard way.

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by Darky
And what about Moses? Aren't there accounts of Egypt once owning Jewish slaves, and all of a sudden they're gone? I'm not sure, but hasn't that been proven?

Yes there is. It was recorded that pharoh ramses releases the hebrews because of the plagues their leader brought on egypt. It doesnt say "Moshe did this" (Moshe is Moses' real name for those of you who don't speak hebrew) but it did acount for the exodus, archeologists have even evidence to support the story of Joshua and the wall of Jericho, but i cant find the article right now so don't take it as law if I can't prove it.

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by OriginalRanger
Suuuure...Kent Hovind loving crackpot.


Nope, Jew loving crackpot I thank you!:p

[Nightcrawler]

Originally posted by Pixel312
Ok, I need to get something straight with everybody, because I see this way too often on the net. There is no common personality within Christians. Christians are not perfect. All Christians aren't perfect little snot-nosed son-of-a-guns who think they're better than everyone else. In fact, if there, are then they're probably not truly Christians. A Christian is a plain-old dude who had been saved. A Christian could've murdered a person, robbed a bank, slapped a baby, kicked an old lady, masturbated three times a day, whatever. A Christian is a plain person. The only difference is that they're going to Heaven. Christianity is not reserved for "good people". There is no such thing. It's for people who are sick of living a sick stupid lie. Please never say it's not for you. That's like saying "Ok, well, it's great that you just let yourself get beat to death for me, but um, you did it for no reason. No thanks." So you say sorry you died and all, but make it in vain? How could you do that to a person? How could you do that to Jesus? He's not mythological. He's not just a Santa Claus coming to bring all the little kiddies Bible stories. He's saved my life and he could save yours. I don't want you who haven't felt the change to find out the hard way.

Good call, you can't jusge any religion by one, or all of its followers. THere have been many people that have disgraced every religion. Religion is essential no different than a government, there are laws that you keep (most make sense) and an authority figure that keeps record, its just more supernatural.